The Artistic Eye

General Moho topics.

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kellz5460
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The Artistic Eye

Post by kellz5460 »

I'm looking at some of my junk on youtube and it seems that my art work is regressing while at the same time, the animation may be getting a tad smoother but I just think that's because I'm animating in 24fps now instead of 15.

I know ppl say you can double up on 12s but I actually am seeing the difference on 24. It's so much more fluid.

So what am I talking about in this thread? I...don't know. I can't say it's I'm hitting a wall. It's more like I hit the wall and am dying- since to me, it seems everything I do is getting worse not better.

Then again, I have stacks of 50pgs in groups of cartoons as yet un-animated since I've been just drawing so much lately...meh...

Want to see some doodles-

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xpXjkoq-lbc

They're for the next shinobi noir ep- but I'm trying to get more....expressive? with poses and action and all that jazz....

Image

and yes- I made this just for this thread....

I have to stop making threads like this

The reason for this thread-

http://www.newgrounds.com/portal/view/581946

That guy HAS to be using AS- I see bones and everything...but he's so GOOOD.. artworks...humour...its awesome...and awesome to see AS on NG
Last edited by kellz5460 on Tue Nov 01, 2011 7:24 am, edited 1 time in total.
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aleXean
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Post by aleXean »

It's not AS on Newgrounds...Flash has IK dude.
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slowtiger
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Post by slowtiger »

Yeah, this Nyancaxx thing was quite good. But hey, you're on par with drawings and animation. What he really has is a good story and a good storyboard. He's got an idea, and he fleshed it out - some other guy would've done a gif with the girl staring for 1 minute, then puking in the last 3 frames. In fact this even is a tad bit too long (for my taste).
SvenFoster
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Post by SvenFoster »

kellz your drawings are a good as this fellas. I think slowtiger has hit the nail on the head.
They have put a lot of work into the storyboard and shots and it shows...It must have taken them ages, to storyboard *and* animate.

...wish I had their focus.. heck I'd settle for your focus ;)

dont be down. you are pretty awesome too.
--Sven
What *if* the Hokey cokey *is* what its all about?
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dueyftw
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Post by dueyftw »

I agree with Slowtiger. Planning is everything. Animation is not film or video tape where, "hey I got an outline and lets shoot some things." Ad-lib and re-shoot the same shot 20 different times and picking the best performance. And then if it doesn't look right go back and do it again.

Their is too much work involved to be throwing away finished animation.

Write a script or outline

Then storyboards

Then animation.

Each step requires more work, but a script change is easier than a storyboard and storyboard changes are much easier than animation.

Ahh deja vu

Dale
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AmigaMan
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Post by AmigaMan »

Kellz5460 I agree with the others here. Your drawing is very good. The style you've chosen is quite difficult to get right. I know I struggle with anything that isn't very cartoony so I admire your skill.
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kellz5460
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Post by kellz5460 »

dueyftw wrote:I agree with Slowtiger. Planning is everything. Animation is not film or video tape where, "hey I got an outline and lets shoot some things." Ad-lib and re-shoot the same shot 20 different times and picking the best performance. And then if it doesn't look right go back and do it again.

Their is too much work involved to be throwing away finished animation.

Write a script or outline

Then storyboards

Then animation.

Each step requires more work, but a script change is easier than a storyboard and storyboard changes are much easier than animation.

Ahh deja vu

Dale
yeah i know- its just, how do i learn storyboarding- other than setting up the way you want it- i'm talking about the artistic eye. Framing certain shot in your mind and translating that to paper. The process I know. But getting exactly what I want the way I see it in my head is something I don't know how to do yet
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kellz5460
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Post by kellz5460 »

*** I retitled this thread Because this is what I'm talking about

Any student can learn to storyboard or draw or animate- I'm talking about the artistic eye. The actual shot. Lines and symmetry and the beauty of art. Somethings you can see can have this quality- other things are mechanistic reproductions of it but lack the soul. I realize its kinda of stupid question because art is art.

Something like Salvador Dali's Persistence of Memory Image

Anybody can draw clocks and trees with a landscape background- and a decent student can warp them. UGH

i don't know what I'm saying- It's not the surrealness of the painting, its just an example of something. I guess that mindspace where the quality of image exists...I guess it has more to do with someone's mind that with any outward expression of it because its not just in visual arts, it can be in anything and I see tinges of it even in the most mundane of things. Qualia? I dunno
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SvenFoster
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Post by SvenFoster »

I'd lay money that Dali was never happy with his work.

In my humble opinion the perfection of art and such distracts massively from the interest of the piece.

Take that painting... Would it have looked as good with a perfect gradient for the sky? or an accurately rendered tree? I mean its thicker above the branch for god sake ;)

When I look at paintings the things that turn me off are photo realistic images.. sure I can see the skill but so what! What gets me every time is letting my mind fill in the gaps.

ok back to animation.....
I think it is Soooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo easy in AS to fall into the 'perfect' mindset as I always feel that AS lets you 'construct' animation. Its extremely possible that it impacts the way you look at a story and changes your artistic eye.

since its about the development of an artistic eye, I'd say forget about animation for a bit and go and draw and paint, sketch and photograph. Get some polymer clay and model. develop the arty brain segment.
--Sven
What *if* the Hokey cokey *is* what its all about?
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hayasidist
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Post by hayasidist »

Hi Kellz.

the thing about art is there isn't a "right" and a "wrong" - there's just "different". Dali makes some people shine with inner warmth, but makes others puke. So does Kandinski. and Monet. and Manet. and van Gogh. and Turner. .... there's a load of bull spouted about the "science" of art - golden ratios, rule of thirds, vanishing points, colour wheels, balance, composition, ... they all have place in some styles but some great artists go out of their way to break all these "rules" in the name of THEIR art.

beauty - in art, in life, in whatever your field of creative endeavour - is the eye of the beholder. Crtitical acclaim is one measure - but the critics are only reflections or manipulators of opinion. Opinion is not objectivity. and, like I said, art is subjective.

You've created stuff that many of us here admire, but you seem to be less happy with. You can't make everyone like everything - so make something that you like.

if you're finding no inspiration, no inner glow of satisfaction, no motivation, no whatever with the genre and style you're in now then maybe take a trip into something different for a while. Take the talent and skill that you **really** do have and apply it to - well - you choose (or ask us here for ideas). See how you get on with it.
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slowtiger
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Post by slowtiger »

The first thing about an artist: he/she must be able to compare two things and say "this is better than the other." Two images, two films, two designs, whatever. As long as you can spot a good picture, nothing is lost. The criteria may change and develop over time, but the basic ability must be there. I might never be able to create a good colour scheme, but I can easily recognize it in other's works.

The second thing is something worded differently by different artists of all times. Chuck Jones said it like this: "As long as you haven't thrown away your first 10.000 crappy drawings, you're no animator." Skill always comes from practice. So just carry on. Do stuff for the sake of doing. Don't always finish, don't always try to be perfect. Be aware of the precious moment your inner artist tells you "this is not going to work", so you can do something different immediately. But do it differently then!
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Post by 3deeguy »

kellz5460, I wanted to paint surrealism like Dali as a teen in the 1960's. I reasoned that a camera could capture reality better than any artist so I decided to paint subjects from my imagination. Some adults called me weird and my uncle said "Artists don't make money until they're dead." I said "What's the use?"
I'm not as impressed by Dali today. Aside from the ants and the fly there is no life in the picture and the water is like glass. There is no breeze. I still love art in whatever form it takes.

I agree with what you said. A ruler-straight line cannot express the life that's in an artist's straight line. A device that plays a song 'perfectly' sounds lifeless. You can tell the difference. Through art I express my fingerprint, my signature, my imagination. Your work will always be special because relatively few have the ability to express artistically what so many appreciate.
Cheers, Larry
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Post by Rudiger »

Have you ever seen Dali's early work?
http://sdali42.tripod.com/daliearlyworks.htm

Some of those could really have been painted by anybody, but they were necessary steps for him to go through to produce the great work he would later create.

The way I see it, art is a combination of technique and expression, and it is much easier to express your ideas when you have control over the technique. While fairly ordinary in their own right, those early works of Dali would have helped him develop his technique, enabling him to be free to express anything his mind could conceive later on in his career.

I guess want I'm trying to say is, allow the technique to come first, and expect the artistry to follow.
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Post by SvenFoster »

You can only forget about the rules once you know them inside out. Think back learning to drive god that was hard. Now the biggest problem is concentrating enough.
--Sven
What *if* the Hokey cokey *is* what its all about?
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Post by 3deeguy »

Rudiger, A 'technique of expression' is a great way to look at art. In this forum I gain knowledge of the fundamentals and the principles of that technique. There are a lot of things I'd like to express so I'm grateful for what I've learned here.

I also think that 'constant learning' is what the human brain does. I want to be better at what I do today than I was yesterday. Being frustrated with the speed of progress is normal in my opinion. It is necessary to have an ongoing mental challenge.

A cow looks out at all that beautiful green grass and thinks; "What could possibly be better than this?" In the cow's mind, life is good.
Cheers, Larry
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