Moho 12

General Moho topics.

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Re: Moho 12

Post by Víctor Paredes » Fri Jul 29, 2016 9:16 pm

Oddernod wrote:One feature that's still a mystery to me that I didn't get answered at SIGGRAPH was Pin Bones — anyone have an educated guess on what this might be?
Hi Oddernod, do you know if you talked with me or someone else? Maybe I forgot to show Pin Bones some times :)
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Re: Moho 12

Post by Oddernod » Fri Jul 29, 2016 9:20 pm

I missed you! Talked to Mike and Uli — who showed me a wicked example of the Smart Warp tool on a handpainted face. Incredible control over the Puppet Tool I'm used to fighting in After Effects. Can't wait to get my hands on the update — looks like a lot of care went into it.
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Re: Moho 12

Post by Greenlaw » Fri Jul 29, 2016 9:55 pm

Pin Bones are bones with zero length and a circular influence. This gives you a different way to deform artwork--not just for translation but also for radial scaling. You can use Pin Bones with regular bones and Pin Bones will naturally work with the new Smart Warp mesh system.

Together, the new system is kinda like Puppet in AE but MUCH more powerful because it works with ALL of Moho's deformation tools.
Last edited by Greenlaw on Fri Jul 29, 2016 10:57 pm, edited 5 times in total.
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Re: Moho 12

Post by Oddernod » Fri Jul 29, 2016 10:23 pm

Ah, perfect — makes a lot of sense. Cannot wait to see the examples for all these new features.
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Re: Moho 12

Post by exile » Sun Jul 31, 2016 12:50 pm

I'm hoping the warp thing will become clearer at some point - don't want to exasperate pro users, but I thought mesh and warp were 3D features. Another improvement in freestyle drawing with fewer points would be nice.

I haven't noticed any comments on McCoy Buck's contest for a free copy of Moho 12 https://www.facebook.com/groups/AnimeStudioPros/ that arrived in my mailbox today. I don't expect to win anything, but it might push me to develop a new character or two a bit faster.
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Re: Moho 12

Post by djwaterman » Sun Jul 31, 2016 2:25 pm

Wow, always the last to know anything, this looks great, I mean really great. The name is fantastic as well.
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Re: Moho 12

Post by Greenlaw » Sun Jul 31, 2016 3:19 pm

exile wrote:...I thought mesh and warp were 3D features.
Not at all...in fact, this is very much a 2D concept. As mentioned earlier, Mesh Warp and Pin Bones are similar ideas to Liquify and Puppet in After Effects, but in Moho's take you get far more customization (you get to define your own shapes, triangulation, and resolution,) and more control (it works with all Moho rigging and drawing tools, and you can even define the individual stacking order of the polygons.)

If you're not familiar with how mesh warping works, believe it or not, ASP 11 (and earlier) already generates meshes under-the-hood and uses bones to deform them. ASP did that invisibly for you but now, in Moho, you'll be able to define your own meshes so you won't get stuck with using meshes that have low-polygon edge segments (like you might have seen in long skinny limbs and tails,) and you can optimize how the shapes deform. This opens up a whole new world by allowing artists to use the same corrective morph capabilities for bitmaps and Smart Bones that we currently enjoy with vector art and Smart Bones. But Mesh Warp is not just for bitmaps--it also adds a whole new range of deformation for points and vectors that you cannot achieve with bones alone.

Yes, the new and improved drawing tools are significant too...and Mesh Warp will let you do even more to animate your drawings.

With Moho 12, 'cut out' style animation is about to get a major facelift.
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Re: Moho 12

Post by exile » Sun Jul 31, 2016 3:36 pm

Thanks, Greenlaw. I've never worked with After Effects, so didn't know the concepts everyone was talking about. Sounds really interesting, I hope it won't make the software more complicated. So many possibilities of AS 11 I've barely scratched ...
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Re: Moho 12

Post by Greenlaw » Sun Jul 31, 2016 3:38 pm

Don't worry about it. You're not required to learn and use the new features, but they're there for you when you're ready to use them. :P

In 'analog' terms, the concept of mesh warping in Moho is like drawing on elastic paper:

1. The new mesh creation tools let you cut your paper into specific shapes; the tools even even let you cut holes in the paper.

2. The new drawing tool (actually, not new but definitely better,) let you draw on that paper.

3. The new Pin Bones let you tack-down regions of the paper, stretch and twist it in new ways.

4. Since the mesh is just connected points in the workspace, you can animate those points like regular vector points. In fact, the mesh points ARE regular vector points so you probably already know how to work with meshes.

And these tools don't replace what you already know in ASP, they add to it.
Last edited by Greenlaw on Sun Jul 31, 2016 8:25 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Moho 12

Post by wizaerd » Sun Jul 31, 2016 4:10 pm

Firstly, I'm happy to see the Moho name come back... Secondly, the Warp Mesh, while I haven;t seen it firsthand, sounds more like something found in Live 2D... http://www.live2d.com/en/ And if so, I think it's gonna be a lot of fun to mess around with.
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Re: Moho 12

Post by exile » Sun Jul 31, 2016 4:15 pm

That is a clear explanation of some difficult concepts - sounds like it will be fun working with the new tools. If the new version is that good, they can call it Moho or Homo or whatever they want. :)
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Re: Moho 12

Post by ruscular3d » Sun Jul 31, 2016 6:24 pm

Can the pin bone be assign to the bone, so it can retain its shape thru the rotation of the bone?
Can pin bone also shape the depth of the layers as well? Push it back or forward ?
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Re: Moho 12

Post by Psmith » Sun Jul 31, 2016 7:09 pm

Greenlaw (or others):

Since words are so limited in describing the visual nature of 2D meshes being deformed by "nodes" - I wonder if I can ask you to view the following video and do a short comparison between what I demonstrate, using OpenToonz "Plastic Tool", and what will eventually be in the next version of Moho?

I know, just from your description, that the new "Smart Mesh" functions are deeper and allow more control - but do these functions also provide a layer of complexity to the user? Is there an "automatic" preset for using these functions that makes it as simple (or simpler) to use than what I have demonstrated in the following video?



Thanks,

Greg Smith
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Re: Moho 12

Post by Greenlaw » Sun Jul 31, 2016 9:08 pm

Sorry, I shouldn't say anything beyond what's already been shown publicly at Siggraph. It would be better for Mike, Victor and others who are officially connected to Smith Micro to show and explain when the time comes. I believe official answers will be coming soon so be patient. :)
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Re: Moho 12

Post by Greenlaw » Sun Jul 31, 2016 9:37 pm

ruscular3d wrote:Can the pin bone be assign to the bone, so it can retain its shape thru the rotation of the bone?
Can pin bone also shape the depth of the layers as well? Push it back or forward ?
Pin Bones are Bones. In fact, you create them using the same Add Bone tool and you can parent Pin bones to other bones or other bones to Pin bones. As for deforming in 3D space, that's a great question. My guess is no but I don't know for sure. You can, however, fake depth and foreshortening effects by scaling Pin bones.

BTW, my comments are based on the version of Moho that was shown at Siggraph. Naturally, the software may possibly change before it's released so don't hold me to any of this. :)
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