Koalas Cartoon

[SvenReyter]

I finished this a few weeks ago, it's the first proper episode of a cartoon I posted here a few months ago. I appreciate the tips from the first post, especially from Lumpy who pointed out that I needed to blur the backgrounds a bit. Thanks, that helped a lot. Fair warning, still a lot of unnecessary swearing, and I haven't improved much with the software, but I enjoy working with it.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FPRQ3Fwctok

First attempt

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YDDXoitt1zU

[Danimal]

Well, I still didn't make it all the way through. In fact, the way I was watching it probably was more entertaining than the video itself:

"Curse curse curse '80s reference curse" >>skip<< "Curse '80s reference curse" >>skip<< "curse curse" - to someone walking by, they probably would have gotten a chuckle out of this.

I'll give it this much: there's some basic movement in the background, and we've got a whole new set to look at occasionally with well constructed and animated people who didn't even swear in the few minutes of this I could watch, but there still doesn't seem to be much going on outside of that.

Through the use of the other set and human characters, we're at least given some clue as to what's going on and why these koalas are being watched, which is a step in the right direction. I'm still given no reason to want to watch them though, except that hey look! They're bears! And they're talking about a movie I've seen! WOW!

Outside of that, I'm sorry to say that pretty much everything I said on the first video still pertains.

[SvenReyter]

Fair enough. Danimal, I did say there was a lot of unnecessary swearing specifically for your benefit.

[Danimal]

Fair enough. Danimal, I did say there was a lot of unnecessary swearing specifically for your benefit.

Yeah, but I was hoping this time around there might have at least been something of a story. There was a kernel of one, but not enough to give a compelling reason to keep watching. Maybe if at the end the humans went out and machine gunned the koalas into piles of goo I might have stuck around just for the satisfaction of never having to hear them speak again? Just a thought.

[SvenReyter]

Jesus, what is wrong with you? I'm sorry you wasted your time, but, I really don't understand why you feel the need to attack something that I innocently posted to get a little feedback on.

[Danimal]

Jesus, what is wrong with you?

I guess what's wrong is I keep forgetting people don't want an honest opinion.

[AmigaMan]

I thought the drawings and designs were great. Other than that I have to agree with Danimal. I got to 3 minutes in, saw it lasted 15 minutes in all, and decided I couldn't watch for another 12 minutes. There was nothing to keep me watching. Of course, that's just my opinion

[ddrake]

Oh, don't mind Danimal too much... I think we're all just going a little stir-crazy dealing with the void left by the absence of Scabiebabie. But you know, there are always 3 solid options when it comes to forum feedback...

1. Listen to other people's suggestions and try to improve your work.

2. Take critiques with a grain of salt, knowing that everything is a learning process and still dictated by your own personal vision.

3. Get indignant and create negative attitudes resulting in a forum feeding frenzy that, while entertaining, will ultimately distract me from animating for countless hours.

Any of the 3 are actually fine by me, as I'd probably find ways to distract myself anyway.

[SvenReyter]

I'm fine with critical honesty. I just think the way with which he delivered said honesty was oddly aggressive, and, there was no reason for that. I really couldn't care less if people like the writing. I just wanted some feedback on the drawings and animation. Last time a few people gave me some great advice that really helped.

[ddrake]

I'm fine with critical honesty. I just think the way with which he delivered said honesty was oddly aggressive, and, there was no reason for that. I really couldn't care less if people like the writing. I just wanted some feedback on the drawings and animation. Last time a few people gave me some great advice that really helped.

Well, I have watched the whole thing now. I think the main issue here and why you might get a little more frustrated sounding undertones is that you're not really giving us anything that much different, therefore nothing new to really critique, so it all mostly falls back to content and story.

I think the character design and artwork are well done. As for the animation, there's nothing wrong with your execution and the simple approach, but it draws us back to square one where the "story" and timing become the focus. And if you're asking people to watch 15 minutes worth of something to share your story and they're stopping after a couple minutes, then something is clearly ineffective with the project or you haven't found your proper audience.

From that standpoint, if you are not in charge of the writing itself or don't wish to alter anything relating to story, then my opinion is that the animation needs to step up and carry the show. The characters are moving as if they are sitting in tree and talking, (or standing in a room and talking) just fine. (And as I said, I think keeping things simple and relatively static can work,) But I think it still works best in very short form.

If you're taking story out of the equation, then ask yourself or anyone whether they want to watch 15 minutes of koalas sitting in a tree and talking. I think if the answer is anything but "not really," it's going to be the questions, "Are they doing anything else?" or "What are they talking about?"

And we're back to the classic impasse. To engage the audience more, maybe the animation should be a little more lively and interesting to watch, timing a little snappier or just shorter presentation overall. And that's if you must rely on your one-trick pony, Mr. Ed with tourettes.

But anyway, I don't want to sound aggressive or mean about anything either, and I'll say I probably like it more than Danimal does Maybe if you had something specific you're looking for feedback on, and ask a question pointing there, then we'd be less hung up on dialogue/content/story and steer things back to the animation work.

Keep at it, and try not to let us piss you off too much.

[SvenReyter]

I'm not pissed off about anything. I'm fine with what Danimal said about the cartoon, I never really expected anyone on the forum to like it and I seen his cartoons...didn't care for them anymore than he cares for mine. Not making a judgement on the animation, as I have no grounds to do that, But, the content wasn't for me.

With the approach, I'm working around a lot of limitation. The koalas don't move because I haven't gotten the hang of leg movements. I thought having them more or less perched would be a bit more palatable than trying to explain why they walk like they have polio. Trust me, I would like to do more, I just can't right now. Turning heads and walking completely baffle me. So I tried to make it about the conversation. I'm just not very good with the software. I'm hoping an episode or two down the line I can branch out into a bit more movement.

I really don't know anything specific to ask for feedback about in animation. I don't know much about it and you've kind of got me thinking about how great a tourettic Mr. Ed would be. Needless to say I would watch it. I know you meant that to be a disparaging comment, but, that made my day.

Thank you for taking the time to watch it and for the feedback. I'll keep that in mind.

[Danimal]

So I tried to make it about the conversation.

Yet the writing and story don't matter. I'm sensing a copout.

so it all mostly falls back to content and story.

It always falls on the story. If there isn't one, there's nothing. What's unfortunate is ALL previous comments on the original hinged around the terrible writing and cursing/slash unfunny ChirsTucker/Chris Rock impression. Yet the only thing that stuck is "blur the background."

If someone just wanted advice on animation, they'd post a 30 second clip. It's been done a million times. "Does this look like a koala in a tree?" - done. This was requesting a critique on the overall work. A 15 minute work. 15 minutes of no story and some idiot cursing.

It's been said that a sign of insanity is doing the same thing but expecting a different result. This is almost identical to the original koala cartoon, yet somehow this time around it was supposed to be revered despite ignoring every comment that could have helped it, i.e., those regarding the total lack of character and story (which was every comment without exception). Yes, the background is blurred. And how about that, there's movement in the scenery. Nicely done animation never, ever masks a total lack of interesting story. Something visually stunning (which this isn't) never makes someone stop thinking "why am I watching this? What's happening?" This is almost it...

ask yourself or anyone whether they want to watch 15 minutes of koalas sitting in a tree and talking. I think if the answer is anything but "not really," it's going to be the questions, "Are they doing anything else?" or "What are they talking about?"

The answer will always, always be "no."

As I've said so many times before, there's potential here, but it's lost trying to be something that's been done before, and done with actual skill. This scene itself could actually be made into something funny and interesting with the removal of the cursing, shortening it to about 45 seconds, and adding an actual ending that punctuates what's happening. But that would involve caring and not just "I made this and you should like it because I did."

Jeez, are we sure this ISN'T Scabiebabies?

[ddrake]

...you've kind of got me thinking about how great a tourettic Mr. Ed would be. Needless to say I would watch it. I know you meant that to be a disparaging comment, but, that made my day.

I'm glad, because I meant it to be a joke, but the tone of everything didn't seem right to undermine the disparaging-ness of everything else... (And for some reason other people don't always appreciate it when I point out when and how and why I'm funny.)

Overall I understand what you're saying, and you do have to deal with things within whatever confines you are working with. And the "finding your audience" thing is going to be an issue for anyone creating anything of any kind anywhere. (Sorry for getting a little sing-songy)

Turns out, not everyone likes the same stuff... and that's annoying and great at the same time. But I don't think that's a deal breaker for anyone here when it comes to animation, and discussion of different approaches.

As far as asking the specific questions, I realize that you've got plenty of work on this "in the can" for now, but if you are looking to try out some different things, I'd suggest posting a clip of testing out your Polio-Koalio walk, and have people take a go at that. (Especially if you already know it's not what you're looking for. It can only improve or stay the same... ok, maybe get worse, but that'd be mostly on you.)

...

And...ok...I'm sorry... but I still want to go back to the "conversation" of the koalas and mention that I did find many moments of it funny/clever/entertaining... but only in moments. It is just that it's a long rehash of the same kind of conversation over and over. If you're the animator/director of this project in any way, just trim it back some. This whole process from writing to directing to animating to whatever requires identifying the strengths, playing those up, and being able to cut anything less.

Those are my thoughts for now.

[Little Yamori]

Still laughing about Mr. Ed with Tourette's, I think Nick and Will could do something with that one .

As for the Koalas, just dive into a new file, import them and experiment like crazy. Try a head turn in a switch layer, it takes a little effort, but there's plenty of help here on the board when it comes to sharing details on techniques. Do the walk like ddrake said and just keep at it, when you get to a point where it clicks, then polish up things and give it a whirl again.

And I would take the harsh responses as a challenge, stories can never be to everyone's liking, but if it's well done, then you'll get critics to say " well done, not my cup of tea, but well done." I think that's a good goal for all of us

[ddrake]

You'll get critics to say " well done, not my cup of tea, but well done." I think that's a good goal for all of us

Well said.