old skool animaition

NerdmastaX · Post by **NerdmastaX** » Fri Apr 22, 2005 4:41 am

im planning on animating the old fashon way, i wondered what the standard frame rate is for paper based animation so i can do a basic animation in moho and use it as a reference, ive realized that you can only get old skool quality when you do the old skool work.

7feet · Post by **7feet** » Fri Apr 22, 2005 5:00 am

How Old Skool do you want to go? A lot of old silent era animation is one frame, one cel. One frame per move is the only way I ever did any of my (either personal or professional) clay and model animation. And that was all (american film standard) film, so that would be 24 frames per second, a move every frame. Many cartoons are animated "on two's", so you only do a move every other frame. In a digital medium, you can choose you're framerate at will. You only have to be concerned if, in the end, you want it shown on TV or a movie screen. I always think about that. In the end, I hope eventually, that I'll be able to see one of the pieces I've done on a big stupid movie screen, so I always go 24 frames. But that's a choice.

Post by **Lost Marble** » Fri Apr 22, 2005 5:28 am

7feet wrote:In the end, I hope eventually, that I'll be able to see one of the pieces I've done on a big stupid movie screen, so I always go 24 frames.

There should be an independent movie theater somewhere that has a night once a month or so where all of us animation geeks can go and screen our work. Wouldn't it be great to see some of your work on the big screen? Ah...

7feet · Post by **7feet** » Fri Apr 22, 2005 6:18 am

But where? I was in the Motion Picture Projectionist's union in New York for 3 years, Many of the people I used to work with have boght out theatres, and if there were enough folks around, I'm sure I could Work out a screening. At least to get the space. But the gear is all 35 mm. I've helped, in the old days, with the Brooklyn Underground Film Festival. But so few theatres where it would be possible have digital projection gear on hand, you need to get that together. And at least judging by the commonly seen members here, Moho is everywhere. Hell, if there was material enough to make it work, I'd sure try to get a slot in a festival here.

Unfortunately, for a regular monthly slot, it's pretty bloody expensive to even keep a theater open for an extra hour or so. The only ones I'd think of approaching are some of the very few old single or double screen houses, and they get fewer and fewer. The old Commodere Theater, in my neighborhood which recently closed, was so 20's it was hard to believe. They were generally second run, so if someone would guarantee an audience, they were down. But now it's going to be "Luxury Condos".

I worked in a really old theater where I found old prints of silent cartoons I'd never heard of before or since. God, I regret not taking them. You have to be careful with those old prints (nitro stock and all), but I did screen them for my lil' ol' self after hour. Thankfully, they didn't explode, and it was some of the coolest animation I can think of. I'm surprised it ran, it must have been there since around when the theater opened in 1927.

Okay, ramble, but I'd like that.

Post by **Lost Marble** » Fri Apr 22, 2005 6:23 am

Oh, I'm sure it's totally impractical. I have no idea how you would make something like that happen - it's just something that "should" happen.

I guess the other approach is to make your animation good enough to get accepted into some festivals, and let them worry about the practicalities.

7feet · Post by **7feet** » Fri Apr 22, 2005 6:42 am

Oh, jeez. I guess, I was tring to be practical. It's my nature. But HELL YEAH, it would be nice if that were possible. Mebbe so.

bupaje · Post by **bupaje** » Fri Apr 22, 2005 6:56 am

Maybe you if you got a few good entries you could approach PBS. They have an Arts Showcase and I've seen some cool stuff on there. I wouldn't be surprised if they wouldn't mind some free material as they are always trying to raise money -might be good for them and good for exposure for the artists involved.

7feet · Post by **7feet** » Fri Apr 22, 2005 6:59 am

!!!

always with the good ideas... Have some friends at channel 13 (thinking, thinking...)

bupaje · Post by **bupaje** » Fri Apr 22, 2005 7:22 am

That would be great. I've seen some professional stuff here -hope to put something out there myself eventually. Starting a cartooning class in 3 weeks at the local university to take care of some of those things I need to learn.

7feet · Post by **7feet** » Fri Apr 22, 2005 7:44 am

What we really need is one of those supposedly near future video conference call kinda apps to throw things around. I've done some pretty cool stuff on my own, but I know that I'm a much better collaborator. All of the things that I'm really proud of I was able to do because I could work with people of the same intent. But that was physical. If a way to work interactively, in realtime, could be figured out... Well that might not be so good, as I'd probably turn into a big lump in front of my computer.

Nahhh. Outside is too much fun. But something like some of the music collaboration software would be pretty damn cool.

7feet · Post by **7feet** » Fri Apr 22, 2005 8:02 am

Never done ICQ. Horrible to say for someone as geeked out as I seem to be. Chat? Ummmmm, way rarely. If it's directed towards something, that makes the difference.

Hey - Bujape, I was referring to a post you had made, and then when I sent it down the pipe, yers was gone! Once again, I try to reference vapors.

BA · Post by BA » Fri Apr 22, 2005 8:50 am

know what you're getting yourself into before you sit down to draw a frame-by-frame animation......

I made an 11-minute film, drew every frame myself (at 12 frames per second), and it took 3 years...

Now some time later I've discovered Moho and am kicking myself for not being able to travel back in time with the latest version of this amazing program.

Burn me for saying it, but I believe that once more pro animators get their hands on moho, classical hand-drawn cartoons will be a thing of the past...

<shameless plug>
speaking of things of the past... you can get yourself a copy of my film at www.griddleville.com ... bonus features include detailed behind-the-scenes exploration of the whole process... plus you get to support independent animation!
</shameless plug>

Either way, best of luck!!! And make sure you get a nice chair.

7feet · Post by **7feet** » Fri Apr 22, 2005 9:29 am

Oops. So it opens with "Watch" and then goes to "when you buy". Shameless plugs aside, a taste would be nice.

bupaje · Post by **bupaje** » Fri Apr 22, 2005 5:08 pm

7feet wrote:Hey - Bujape, I was referring to a post you had made, and then when I sent it down the pipe, yers was gone! Once again, I try to reference vapors.

Sorry. referenced a collebrative software tool I had seen a long time ago but on second look realized it didn't have a whiteboard and a few other features. I deleted it rather quickly didn't think you'd see it before I deleted it -sorry.

jorgy · Post by **jorgy** » Fri Apr 22, 2005 6:22 pm

I noticed a few days ago that Google has started a new video service. Right now, it is in a beta period where they are asking people to upload their material. Eventually, you will be able to charge people to view your material. I was thinking it would be nice to be able to upload a cartoon, and charge, say, $1, for people to view it. All to try and build up a following...

Now, granted, it's not the big screen, but it is a new distribution method.

https://upload.video.google.com/